Still Enmeshed?

Is anyone here still in a relationship with their narcissist? Or was anyone "stuck" for a time and unable to do non-contact right away?

Yes, that would be me. I am still married to and still living with my husband who is a narcissist with borderline probably. He is getting "help" such as it is, but I believe he has his therapist good and hoodwinked into thinking he is the poor innocent victim of MY raging behavior. I don't actually rage by the way - but as in all things narcissist I have gotten angry at him for his abusive behavior towards me which he turns around and calls abuse.

Now that I am eyes wide open and can see what is happening, and until I can get out, I Do. Not. En. Gage. We handle logistics that is about it. The rest of the time I nod and smile vaguely. And he seems to be perfectly happy with this hostage situation. I cannot get out because I have two children and I do not have a well enough paying job. In the past, to avoid having to take responsibility for an affair, or to deflect from an affair, or to avoid the stress of a new child, he has intentionally gotten himself fired from his jobs. I can see now the absolute uncanny and not possibly coincidental timing in each and every case. So needless to say, in order to successfully get out - ie in a way that will not leave me and my children homeless or worse in a position where we'd have to go back - I have to have a good paying job which is proving difficult. So, here I am, still enmeshed but coming out of the brainwashing haze.

I hear ya, Otter. We're not all able to disengage from them so easily. In my case, it's my furry children and being disabled, my income is extremely low.

I did, however, finally bite the bullet and request his exit. (talk about a very stressful moment) He's currently playing silly buggars and all, but I'm hoping he'll start to actually do something about moving. I've made it about as easy as I can. But a friend has actually offered some of her friends to help him leave if he decides to make this difficult. Not in anything bad or illegal - just as in moving his stuff and maybe a little bit of moral support for me.

It's a relief when you know you're not alone in your fight. Too bad it has to be a fight.

All good thoughts for you and your situation.

Enmeshed is precisely what I am and I know it. Only, I'm ashamed to admit that so much of the time I don't want to face it. Either I get scared of the financial repercussions or I buckle at the idea of losing the little bit of good we have left.

When we're 'good' it mirrors the honeymoon phases we used to experience. They're much weaker than they used to be but I knowingly accept it since some good is better than all bad and we do have to share the roof over our heads.

Like Otter, I've got children to consider and providing some kind of a home or place to live, comes first. Then there's the resistance to letting him go that I mentioned. And I have sold myself out many times in the process. That's why I say I'm ashamed, because I sell out for so little and I know it deep down.

I don't know what else to do. I'm not made of stone. I've always cared deeply for him so it's easy to pull me back in, because I want so much to believe in the good.

Sorry if I've been a poor example of what you mean. I should be so much stronger. My mind knows it but it's the rest of me that gets in the way.

Wow.  What a great thread.  I'm no longer enmeshed, but I recognize myself in all of your posts.  I don't have any kids (I have animals), so I didn't have to worry about that.  I'm also on disability and have a low income.  I currently live with my mother and sister and take care of them. It's very stressful for me because I have chronic fatigue syndrome, so I never have enough energy.  Also, I think my sister may either be borderline or covert narcissist, but not to the degree that he was.  She at least has narcissistic tendencies, but she may not actually have NPD.  However, she activates me.

For a very long time, up until recently, I did still see the good in our relationship.  I wanted to remember those parts.  (I think this puts me in a place of power instead of weakness, because I chose to stay in the relationship.)  I never wanted to focus on the bad stuff, and until about a year ago, I didn't even realize he was a narcissist/borderline.  I think he's actually more borderline than narcissist, but he definitely has some of the covert traits of NPD  It's very clear now.  He always turned everything around on me (it's one way he would gaslight me).  In the end he started calling me a narcissist.  That's why I learned about it, to see if he was right.  (He's known about NPD for years, and studied it thoroughly, because of his mother.  I think it helped him become an even better, more effective narcissist, because he knew exactly what to say to me, to make me doubt myself.  That is truly evil.)

I also understand about the anger.  For a long time I believed it was abusive on my part, and that I became abusive as a defense mechanism. Now, I think maybe (after listening to the course material) it was actually a healthy response to being abused.  My mind is still very confused, and I swing heavily between feeling strong and good (today I feel pretty good), to feeling extremely depressed and paralyzed, to feeling angry and victimized (which I don't want to feel, I don't like being a victim).  I also have a huge resentment now toward him, and before I didn't.  I don't want to believe he could do this to me on purpose, that he's capable of that kind of evil.  I think he's probably convinced himself that I'm the abusive one, that I'm the narcissist, because I'm not sure his mind could handle it if he realized the truth.  I'm trying to be positive and work through it, but sometimes my depression gets the better of me, and I feel like I'll never get better.  I'm in my late 50s, so dealing with this kind of trauma this late in life is really, really tough.

It's good to have a place to come, where I can read about other people's experiences, and how they're dealing with things.  cygnus_olor, you're doing the best you can in a f**ked up situation.  Don't beat yourself up.  If you can get out, you'll be able to hang onto the good.  I'm hoping that once I work through everything, I'll be able to let go of my resentment.  I did love him very deeply, and I always thought he loved me deeply.  Anyway.

gigiminer and Otter, it sounds like you guys are dealing with everything and taking care of yourselves.  That's really all we can do.  Stay strong, and good luck to everyone!

Namaste.

jazzycat - I'm in my 50s as well. yes, it adds a little more "something" to it all. I have FMS, so I feel for you with the chronic fatigue. It's enough energy just to get through a day without all the stress.

signus_olor - wish I could offer you some comforting words, but I like what jazzycat said about the situation and doing the best you can. It's not your fault. All we can do is start now to try to make things better where we can.

in mine, he's still here and dragging his feet. I even found a spy recorder he'd planted to try and listen to my conversations. Too bad the only ones I have are with my cats.

I guess you could say that I'm still 'enmeshed'. Or actually, again. In my case, my mother is the narcissist. Or at least I think she is. She's certainly got issues, that's for sure.

I had to move back in with my parents due to my financial situation. On top of that I had a very bad depression for a few weeks, so I felt unable to do anything like get a job and stuff like that. I got myself tested, turns out I've got some personality issues. I'll be going to a clinic in a few weeks for schema therapy, currently going to preparing sessions once a week. I'm actually looking forward to it.

I've just got one problem. My parents are holding me down. I mean, verbally, they seem loving and supportive. I explained how I recognize how my own behaviour gets me in trouble, how it's all caused by wanting to please everyone except myself, not allowing myself to express certain emotions, you know, all the shit you get when you're brought up by a narc. When I tell my mom this, she's like "Oh yes, I get what you mean! But you have to realize that it's ok to say no, and it's ok to say angry." Sounds cool, right?

But then she asks me to do the dishes. And there's hell to pay if I say no. I tried it once. I was tired from therapy, so I told her I'd clear the table but that was it for me. My god, the rage! I had withdrawn myself, so she wasn't able to get mad at me directly, but from my room I could still hear her talking to my dad about how useless I am, not doing anything around the house, that maybe I should start paying for my expenses (which is a serious threat to me, since that would mean I wouldn't keep any money left to get my own things sorted out), that it's taking too long for me to go to therapy, that I'm not trying to get better in the meantime, etc. Having to hear this shit got me very upset. All because I told her I didn't want to do the dishes.

So, I should learn to say no and express my feelings (especially anger), but if I do that towards my mom, shit hits the fan.

Next to that, there's my eating habits. I'm trying to improve them. I'm a serious sugar junkie and I would really like to quit that crap and start eating healthy. Again, verbally, my parents support me. They actually try to help me by telling me not to take that chocolate when I'm reaching for it, for example. When I tell them that the whole family should start eating healthier, they acknowledge I'm right about that. And yet, all they get is junkfood. Well not all, but a lot of it. If I really want to eat healthier, I'd have to survive on willpower 24/7. I managed to do that for a while, but at some point I caved and binged on sweet junk for 2 hours straight. I haven't been able to stay off of sugar since then.

I can't move out due to my finances. I still have debts to pay, by January I'll be rid of some of those debts and will have more money left, which I plan to use to pay for an account on a site for roomsearching, and to save up for furnishing my place once I get one. Until then, I guess I'm stuck here.

Still trying to figure out whether or not my mom is a real narcissist. Her double signals confuse me. Since she's so supportive verbally, I keep thinking there's a chance she does want to change, but simply can't. On the other hand, when I tell her what she could change or how she could go about it, she refuses to admit that she's wrong, or that she has to change. She refuses to acknowledge the fact that she made mistakes in the past, that she's actually still making them. Whenever I address her behaviour, she puts up this huge wall of "There's nothing wrong with me, I don't have to change anything, I'm perfect and I do everything right" and I can't seem to get through. Maybe she's only supportive when it's about changing my behaviour, and she does want what's best for me, but when it comes to her own behaviour, she turns narcissistic. Does that make sense?

Sorry for the rant, it's just, when it comes to this, a lot of thoughts come up and I need to get it out. Tomorrow is another therapy session, I plan on asking if they could give me any tips on how to deal with this situation, they should have some answers there. Wish me luck!

Oh, and you all, hang in there, I hope your situations will change for the better soon!

To all who posted here - thank you for sharing. I am still enmeshed and struggling to see a light at the end of the tunnel. i've been married for decades to a covert narcissist and although I've known for years that something was seriously wrong it's only been through reading, watching you tube and building my understanding that the actual truth of our relationship has gradually dawned. I have unwittingly let this man basically drain the life out of me emotionally and financially and i can't go no contact because if I kick him out he will be on the street and our daughters will feel obligated to take him in. Whilst I've educated myself and know the reality of situation, our daughters still make excuses for him because they are still in the 'rose coloured glasses' stage. I am so ready to let him go and heal.

yann1 - I feel for you. It's a mind boggling place to be. I've since somehow managed to get him out and have at least been able to live semi-no-contact. It was not an easy process. I can only say that it is well worth it.

Try to stash some money while you can. Don't worry it's not much, $5 here, $10 there...just find a place the narc never goes. This is your emergency money. Start to figure out what you can do and what you can't do. These two will interchange as you do more thinking and research.

If you don't have to stay in your home, move. Be the one to leave. I had too many obligations that glued me to my home; it made life so much more difficult. But I still did it. If you can pack a bag and walk out, do it. It sounds scary, but it is an option. You'll need to get to the place where you decide if your life is worth more than your belongings.

I'm not lecturing you or anything. I know just how crazy it is for you right now. Just know that you are NOT trapped. There is a way out...it just takes a bit of time to find it.

All good wishes for you.